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RicG
Member
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Posted: Wed Nov 22nd, 2006 12:43 am |
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After going through my third replacement from OtherWorld Computing (one of my favorite vendors), I was told that some Pismo laptops (for unknown reasons) can't make use of the NuTech NuPower extended capacity batteries. The one I bought (a 6600mAH) would only get up to 49-51% charge after a half-dozen very well controlled conditioning cycles. This situation persisted through any number of PRAM zaps, Open Firmware resets and PMU resets. The store (quite considerately) allowed me to return the last battery for a full refund. I now have a conventional (BTI) replacement on order from another vendor.
I was wondering if my recent XLR8 G4 upgrade could have had anything to do with this?
Thanks,
Ric
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Gary
Administrator
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Posted: Wed Nov 22nd, 2006 01:54 am |
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RicG wrote:
After going through my third replacement from OtherWorld Computing (one of my favorite vendors),... The one I bought (a 6600mAH) would only get up to 49-51% charge after a half-dozen very well controlled conditioning cycles. ...I was wondering if my recent XLR8 G4 upgrade could have had anything to do with this?
Hi Ric,
Thanks for the Question. No, the G4 doesn't have anything to do with it. The Problem is the battery itself. Last year we sold the NewerTechnology batteries, and due to the high rate of batteries that did NOT meet spec, began checking each and everyone. We pre-cycled them for our customer in stock systems.
On the 6600 and 7200, the failure (shortfall) rate was 30-70% depending on the batch! I assume that the vast majority of people never actually verify the charge capacity.
We finally just opted for standard choices and stopped handling the OWC stuff. Although they do a fair job on getting and selling deals on packaged products, their RAM and Batteries leave a bit to be desired.
We've seen about about 2,000 systems here in the last year. Sadly, when customers have a compoonent issue, it's all too often got the OWC brand on it. 
____________________
Gary Dailey
Daystar Technology
http://Daystar-Tech.com, http://Daystar-Store.com
email: gary@daystartechnology.com, chat: garydailey@mac.com
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RicG
Member
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Posted: Wed Nov 22nd, 2006 03:19 am |
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Gary,
That's good to know. There are a lot of raves about these expanded capacity batteries in the various forums, but the first NuPower I received was stone-cold dead (the Pismo didn't even recognize it as a battery). That wasn't a great confidence builder. The second two were pretty frustrating.
For the record, the XLR8 upgrade is outstanding. I've always wanted a Pismo and found one locally in showroom condition. I love having it able to comfortably run Tiger. An interesting aside: with it's classic, sleek lines, people are always asking me if it's one of the "new" PowerBooks when I have it out. I use a dual G5 at home, but the Pismo is the '57 T-bird that I always wanted and finally have.
Ric
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RicG
Member
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Posted: Thu Nov 23rd, 2006 03:14 am |
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Gary,
I tried another brand of battery (BTI) and it isn't even charging. I have a battery icon with the plug when I am on AC power, but no indication of charing either in the icon or the System Profiler. I read through the "Pismo Startup Problems" thread and checked to see if my PMU battery is holding the date. (It's not.)
What is confusing is that my original Apple battery seems to be working fine throughout all of this in terms of charging and discharging. Is the PMU battery/board normally checked during the XLR8 upgrade process? This is the fourth replacement battery I've tried and it's hard to believe my luck is really this bad. Any insight would be welcome.
Thanks,
Ric
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Gary
Administrator
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Posted: Sun Nov 26th, 2006 02:04 am |
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RicG wrote:
Gary,
I tried another brand of battery (BTI) and it isn't even charging. I have a battery icon with the plug when I am on AC power, but no indication of charing either in the icon or the System Profiler. I read through the "Pismo Startup Problems" thread and checked to see if my PMU battery is holding the date. (It's not.)
Your problem could be due to a bad or blown PMU. Your PRAM battery itself will need to hold a charge to keep the PMU going correctly.
First try resetting the PMU with a cold reset then after a few hours verify that the PRAM/PMU battery is holding a charge.
To do an effective reset, simply eject the main battery and unplug the AC, then hit the PMU reset button (on the back by the modem, marked by the white triangle).
After 10 seconds or so, reconnect the AC (no battery yet) and let charge for 4 hours. then try the PRAM battery test again (set date, shut down, disconnect AC, wait 10 minutes, then reconnect and boot to see if the date holds). If not then you have either a bad PRAM battery and/or a bad PMU (this is sounding more like a bad PMU than anything else).
____________________
Gary Dailey
Daystar Technology
http://Daystar-Tech.com, http://Daystar-Store.com
email: gary@daystartechnology.com, chat: garydailey@mac.com
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Gary
Administrator
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Posted: Sun Nov 26th, 2006 02:04 am |
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RicG wrote:
Gary,
I tried another brand of battery (BTI) and it isn't even charging. I have a battery icon with the plug when I am on AC power, but no indication of charing either in the icon or the System Profiler. I read through the "Pismo Startup Problems" thread and checked to see if my PMU battery is holding the date. (It's not.)
Your problem could be due to a bad or blown PMU. Your PRAM battery itself will need to hold a charge to keep the PMU going correctly.
First try resetting the PMU with a cold reset then after a few hours verify that the PRAM/PMU battery is holding a charge.
To do an effective reset, simply eject the main battery and unplug the AC, then hit the PMU reset button (on the back by the modem, marked by the white triangle).
After 10 seconds or so, reconnect the AC (no battery yet) and let charge for 4 hours. then try the PRAM battery test again (set date, shut down, disconnect AC, wait 10 minutes, then reconnect and boot to see if the date holds). If not then you have either a bad PRAM battery and/or a bad PMU (this is sounding more like a bad PMU than anything else).
____________________
Gary Dailey
Daystar Technology
http://Daystar-Tech.com, http://Daystar-Store.com
email: gary@daystartechnology.com, chat: garydailey@mac.com
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RicG
Member
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Posted: Sun Nov 26th, 2006 05:55 am |
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Gary,
After I posted my last message, I found the reset/recharge tip online and now the date is holding. Just one more question, however: if I have a possible hardware (PMU) problem, how is it possible that the original battery is still working fairly well? I've had it through full and partial recharge cycles and the numbers in System Profiler have been quite consistent. Would a bad PMU still work well with an old but working battery? With the XLR8 upgrade, hard drive and memory, I've put quite a bit into the system already, so I don't think a trip to the repair shop would male much financial sense at this point.
Thanks (as always),
Ric
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Gary
Administrator
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Posted: Sun Nov 26th, 2006 02:51 pm |
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RicG wrote:
I found the reset/recharge tip online and now the date is holding.
After you have completed the reset with a dead PMU battery, you need to complete it with a charged PMU battery... this allows the system to rewrite code into the PMU, (the "empty" zap just erased it, but didn't rewrite it. Be sure to disconnect the AC and eject the battery before hitting the reset button, then allow a few seconds for the system to rewrite it. A correctly programmed PMU is crucial for high capacity batteries.
if I have a possible hardware (PMU) problem, how is it possible that the original battery is still working fairly well? I've had it through full and partial recharge cycles and the numbers in System Profiler have been quite consistent.
Um, what are you using to check the charge on the battery? I suggest a third party applicaiton, not Apple System Profiler. ASP is not tested well with third party hardware and can have many issues reading any upgrades (RAM, battery, CPU) correctly. At least that would eliminate the possibility that this is a software issue. We use iBatt which give accurate info on the Mah as well as charging cycle.
____________________
Gary Dailey
Daystar Technology
http://Daystar-Tech.com, http://Daystar-Store.com
email: gary@daystartechnology.com, chat: garydailey@mac.com
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RicG
Member
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Posted: Mon Nov 27th, 2006 02:11 am |
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Gary,
Aside from the profiler, I've been using a Terminal app, battery (v1.4) from http://www.mitt-eget.com/. I believe it uses an ioreg call and parses out the battery info (but may be wrong). However, if I do try buying another battery, I may try iBatt if I'm seeing the partial-charge issue again. I've also run into some interesting tricks using open firmware to wake up and condition an unchargable battery (or wring-out a problematic PMU setting) that would also bypass any OS issues.
Ric
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